Ep 132 The Science + Spirituality of Conscious Cannabis Use with Katie Gross

[00:00:00] Cynthia: You are listening to the Well Connected Twin Cities podcast. I'm your host, Cynthia Shockley, and I'm here to learn alongside you through meaningful conversations with health and wellness practitioners. This is your time to experience some mindset shifts, learn practical tips, and get excited about what is possible.

[00:00:22] We want you to own the power of choice in your personal well being journey. Let's discover what's possible right here in our Twin Cities community.

[00:00:33] Hello, and welcome to the Well Connected Twin Cities podcast. I'm your host, Cynthia Shockley. And in case this episode title didn't give it away, this episode does talk about a recently legalized substance. There is also a teeny bit of adult language used. Please listen to this episode in a setting that feels right to you in today's episode.

[00:00:56] You get to enjoy a conversation with Katie gross, a local cannabis nurse who has so much scientific and personal wisdom to share. You'll hear about Katie's own journey into cannabis use and discover the science of how cannabis actually chemically induces a bliss hormone that our bodies need to function optimally.

[00:01:15] Katie talks about other ways to induce this bliss hormone if cannabis isn't your jam And shares ways to get started on an intentional conscious cannabis practice If you're curious katie gross founded your higher path healing in 2018 She assists women on the healing journey who desire to deepen their spiritual connection and body awareness with energy medicine and plant medicine katie is a nurse guide who facilitates your body's natural ability to achieve peace balance and harmony.

[00:01:45] She is a former Minnesota medical marijuana patient and received a certificate from the Pacific College of Health and Science in Medical Cannabis. She leads community cannabis meditations monthly online and offers one on one hands on healing services in our Wayzata practice.

[00:02:00] She joyfully offers private cannabis and cacao rituals for individuals and groups.

[00:02:06] Here we are with Katie Gross. Hi, how are you doing Katie? 

[00:02:10] Katie: I'm so good. It's so great to be here. 

[00:02:13] Cynthia: Yes, I'm so happy that we were able to make this happen. So I met Katie at the wellness fair at Sunculpa during Twin Cities Wellness Week and I had no idea what to expect. There was a cannabis talk and that was all I knew.

[00:02:33] And I'm like, I'm curious. So I remember I walked in, sat on the floor and Katie had her presentation up on the wall, PowerPoint talking about the science and the spirituality and just. And I was just hearing things about cannabis I just never had heard before. And so I was like, gosh, we need this woman on the podcast.

[00:02:57] I'm glad you're here. 

[00:02:59] Katie: Don't forget the stash box. I busted out the stash box as well. And we used a micro, a microscope to look at the plant medicine. Oh my gosh. It 

[00:03:07] Cynthia: was such an experience. I know, and I saw, I remember there's like a family there together and they're like all passing it and smelling it and They're like, it's so beautiful 

[00:03:19] Katie: She is a beautiful friend 

[00:03:20] Cynthia: Yes.

[00:03:22] I wonder, I usually say rose and thorn, right? Asking what's going well what's not going well, but maybe we even call it like what's the crystal in the stem for you? What's going well with sparkly, what's beautiful in life. And then what's something that might not be something that's so beautiful right now.

[00:03:41] Katie: Yeah, well, I will say that what's beautiful and sparkly is the opportunity and the room for expansion in the cannabis industry. I'm excited to share my voice around cannabis spirituality and education around conscious cannabis use and endocannabinoid system. I think the thorn, if you will, or the stem is just the amount, the mountain of stigma that we have to overcome the mountain of programming around the fear of this plant.

[00:04:13] I used to, I'd say, look at that and it would disempower me, but I feel like we've come into a totally different time. Where the woman's way of medicine is returning. And I think plant medicine is a key to that. And I think we're in a really exciting time. And so I try not to be overburdened by how much work there is to do, but to just get to work.

[00:04:36] So I'm happy to be here to do that, to just get to work and to share and to bring new gnosis to people around the plant medicine. 

[00:04:45] Cynthia: Yeah, beautiful. And I think that's really the larger mission of Well Connected around integrative care, around exposing yourself to new ideas and concepts and things that have been around for, thousands of years And, for one reason or another just fell out of practice or fell out of, just what seems acceptable.

[00:05:06] This has been a big part of your life. And I'm curious what drew you to your work in cannabis and, if you don't mind sharing a little bit of your story there. 

[00:05:16] Katie: I love to share this story. So first I like to say that I was drawn to the cannabis plant long before I ever encountered her.

[00:05:24] Encountered her, I actually ever consumed her. I was drawn to this idea that you could be light and funny. I grew up in a, just a really strict household, right? And like this idea of euphoria and being high was this cool thing, right? But I was also very scared of it. I came to the medicine through my husband.

[00:05:43] My husband was a regular consumer of cannabis in college, which, the typical stereotype, of somebody who uses cannabis. I think he would have fallen into that. And so I joked with people for a very long time that it was going to be my retirement plan.

[00:05:58] And then I consumed her for the first time with some friends. I reached that state of euphoria that evening. And it really then, that was really the beginning of my relationship with her. And it has morphed and evolved and changed and expanded over time. And it came full circle for me in 2021.

[00:06:17] I was just, had just been diagnosed with complex post traumatic stress. I was in a state of being highly emotionally unregulated and triggered. And I went and had surgery for my thyroid, and they severed the nerve to the vocal cords and told me I wouldn't talk again, and, or I wouldn't sound normal, all the things.

[00:06:38] When I never panicked, I knew I could heal my nervous system. I could heal my nerves with cannabis and I just launched myself into my own healing journey. And it was during a cannabis meditation. So I was under the influence of the medicine. I was listening to a throat chakra, vibrational frequency.

[00:07:00] And I felt the nerve come back in. It was incredibly painful. But I felt that moment. And I was had my voice back in three months. And so that's really where things were like, okay, this, the connection between physical health, spiritual health and plant medicines role in all of that is where I belong.

[00:07:18] So that's 

[00:07:19] Cynthia: amazing to just have that really. incredible experience of healing yourself and working with the plant medicine. I'm curious about the science. Cause I know when I was hearing this from you in your original talk I knew, I feel like I heard like tidbits of it here and there in my life, but the way you explained it, just everything clicked into place.

[00:07:46] Do you mind sharing what's going on chemically with cannabis in the body? 

[00:07:52] Katie: So early on in my nursing career, I knew that there was some kind of connection between our spiritual health and our physical health, but I didn't see that modeled back to me in the traditional realms of nursing. And then I found the energy system when I started to practice healing touch and I thought, okay, this is a key, right?

[00:08:11] This is where our spirit and our bodies come into connection. And this is where we can, by influencing the energy system, we can influence the physical health and spiritual health. And then I found the endocannabinoid system and the endocannabinoid system is 1 system that innervates that modulates that impacts every single 1 of our major body systems.

[00:08:31] We have cannabinoid receptors in our eyes in our skin in our livers the endocannabinoid systems sole responsibility is homeostasis. And the plant medicine supports the process. Our body is always going towards innate healing.

[00:08:47] We are innate healers. And we have this receptor system that just so happens to mimic plant medicine. Her plant medicine impacts that. We have cannabinoid receptors that are CB1 and CB2 receptors. CB1s are commonly, more commonly found in the brain, where CB2s are more commonly found in the body. And we have this molecule called bliss.

[00:09:10] We have a molecule that circulates our bodies that's called Bliss. It is anandamide. That is what THC is most closely related to. We used to think that when we went running we had the runner's high that was endorphins. It's actually anandamide. anD so we literally have bliss in our bodies and we have a plant medicine that can supplement that bliss and what happens to the physical body when we're as deficient in bliss, when we're deficient in spirit.

[00:09:36] We have all of these patterns that then begin to contribute to chronic states of illness and dis ease. And so by balancing the endocannabinoid system and the energy system, I believe where our spirits and our physical bodies meet, we can have really radical shifts and big healing experiences from within that completely change someone's lived experience.

[00:10:02] Those are called peak experiences where you have that threshold moment where you're like there was life before this and there's life after this. And that is really what I work with in the cannabis plan is to create those peak experiences for clients to know that the healing is within them. The healing is always within them.

[00:10:19] Gosh. 

[00:10:21] Cynthia: And to know that there is a hormone. That we need, right? And that cannabis can support that is just such a novel concept. And I'm so glad that there's research emerging that's really pointing to this and helping to recognize this.

[00:10:38] And so for those who aren't aware, can you share what terpenes are? 

[00:10:45] Katie: Yes. So one of the magic things about plant medicine is that they work synergistically. There's a lot of things. There's a lot of molecules and chemicals and compounds that are working synergistically together to get you an experience.

[00:10:59] So we commonly know CBD and THC. Those are cannabinoids that come from the plant medicine, but then there's also these chemicals called terpenes. And if you're familiar with aromatherapy is full of these same chemical, highly volatile chemicals that create. healing, that have their own healing properties.

[00:11:16] And so cannabis is full of terpenes. And that is really what creates the experience of the cannabis, not so much the THC and the CBD, it's the combination of the terpenes that create the entourage. That creates the healing experience. So common terpenes that are found in cannabis are lemonene.

[00:11:35] That's an antidepressant. It's uplifting. Tynine, also very uplifting. Mercine and humaline, those are a little bit more sedative. in nature. And so when you're picking cannabis, knowing what those terpenes are, either a through smelling your cannabis and getting a feel for what those terpenes smell like in your cannabis, or having the knowledge and the awareness and the understanding to ask where you're purchasing your medicine.

[00:11:59] Hey, can you tell me what terpenes are in this chemotype? And then when we're looking at administration of oral medications, a lot of times those terpenes are removed through the chemical process so smoking it is really the best way to get that full effect of terpenes.

[00:12:14] Cynthia: All right, so a lot of things to consider, and so definitely would make sense to get a little support just figuring out what the best option is for you making sure that your product is aligned with your intentions. Oh, I 

[00:12:32] Katie: love, yes, that's exactly it. Your product is aligned with your intentions. 

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[00:13:37] Cynthia: But like you mentioned earlier, there's just so much fear and so much misinformation about cannabis.

[00:13:44] I remember in junior high, like with dare coming in, like it's the gateway drug just all of that. I know you touched on this too, so I'm curious if you can share a little bit about the history of why there's this fear around this plant medicine. Yeah. 

[00:14:03] Katie: That's really rooted in racism.

[00:14:06] Cannabis was on the pharmacopeia. It was used regularly as a medicinal herb. It was found in, the Chinese medicine books 2000 years ago. It's been used on every continent for religious and sacred purposes. And then in 1937 it was a lot, right? It started to. Infiltrate the country through really through the soul music of the South and the jazz and and then the, all of the propaganda around the reefer madness came out and that's really when everything shifted.

[00:14:42] And that's when it became prohibited. And now, since we've been in this not very many years, when we really look at human history it's only been outlawed since the 1930s, let's say. Now, coming back to the science, we have a term called clinical endocannabinoid deficiency. We actually now know scientifically that migraines, fibromyalgia, and irritable bowel syndrome are a direct result of not having enough bliss in the system.

[00:15:09] Wow. Not having enough anandamide. And so there is a lot of fear and concern around euphoria. We get that from traditional Christian culture, right? I feel like anything that is outside of you that creates a sense of euphoria is bad. We live in what Midwestern North, Minnesota. So that is a program and that's very difficult to to unlearn.

[00:15:31] But then there's this thing where you have to get high that the expectation or the outcome is to be high when it really is to simply supplement the endocannabinoid system. And so I work a lot with people who have had previous experiences with cannabis who have not, they've not gone well and now they have fibro or chronic pain and they want to come to into a new relationship with her and they have this expectation that there's going to be this euphoria.

[00:15:58] You don't have to have euphoria to get results. You can have your pain go away. You can have your anxiety decrease without a sense of feeling high. And that's really where nurses come in and educating. Plant medicine is very much a patient empowered medicine. And so it's educating you. How does this plant interact with your endocannabinoid system?

[00:16:18] And what's the lowest dose for the big, for the, for our therapeutic goal? Yeah, that's, we don't have to get high. It's not about getting high. Yeah. Sometimes. Sometimes it's about getting high. I am not going to be here and judge you. I, I said in the talk I'm a girl who likes to pop a gummy and go to a big, a movie and enjoy the action of the movie under the influence of some cannabis medicine.

[00:16:42] It definitely augments my play and recreation. But when we're looking at it from a physical healing standpoint, there's a huge range in therapeutic properties and that's what a cannabis nurse can help navigate. Yeah, 

[00:16:55] Cynthia: amazing. And you mentioned that something like running can actually help with anandamide production.

[00:17:03] What are some other things I guess that people can do if for now, like cannabis sounds like too much or too 

[00:17:10] Katie: scary? I'm so glad you asked that question. So we have clinical research that shows that acupuncture increases anandamide. mAssage chiropractic care diet. We have endogenous endocannabinoids, but we need the precursors to them for the body to make them.

[00:17:30] And that is Omega-3 fatty acids. And so I suggest everyone get on a routine of hemp seeds. That's a really good way to get to commune with the plant while also filling the body with those nutritional needs to be able to make your own endocannabinoids healing touch. So those body works, gentle, joyful movement is also one of those ways that we can upregulate or we can enhance our endocannabinoid tone.

[00:17:58] So just 

[00:17:59] Cynthia: living a healthy lifestyle. Gosh, joyful and healthy. And so this is just, cannabis can be a really great supplement for, if some of those things aren't accessible or you just are still low on things. So I'm glad that there is this cannabis nursing field and I know it was like pretty fresh news that this has become a formal formalized field and specialization in Minnesota.

[00:18:29] Can you walk us through the development of this field and like what it means now that it's legal? 

[00:18:34] Katie: Yeah. First the American Nursing Association is the one who just announced that it's a specialty in their eyes. We currently do not have any, board certifications at this point in time.

[00:18:47] This is grassroots, brand new. I would say that there have been cannabis nurses, though, who have been working for decades under the radar, uh, doing this work, which is important work. Right now, it's a, it's an interesting time in nursing. We are faced with incredible burnout rates, and I would say that most of the nurses that I know entered this work as a spiritual call to serve people.

[00:19:17] And and to empower people in their health. And I think we can all agree that the current dynamic and the current structure of our system doesn't really allow for that. And I think that there is a huge future in cannabis nursing because it's patient empowered. We are teaching patients how to manage their energy systems, their endocannabinoid systems, and their nervous systems.

[00:19:39] How, what do I need to be my own healer? And I think that we have this huge in it, cannabis or not cannabis, nurses or healers, and now we have this beautiful bridge that's happening between Western medicine and plant medicine. And it brings me a lot of hope that we can continue to bridge those gaps that the Western world is recognizing cannabis as medicine, and that there's room for us woo nurses to really step more into how we like to work with patients.

[00:20:14] Cynthia: Just creating that freedom for nurses to follow their intuition, to follow what they know is going to serve their patients. 

[00:20:23] Katie: And to also allow for patient autonomy, right? Patients are out there using cannabis. And here's where my kind of lane is now that Minnesota has legalized recreational medicine, recreational cannabis.

[00:20:36] And we've had a longstanding medical program now for several years people are going to be trying to treat themselves. They're going to be trying to use cannabis in a way that brings medicine, but what not necessarily through those channels and avenues. And so it's how do we how do we empower people and how do we give them good knowledge to be able to make educated decisions and how to use their medicine.

[00:21:00] Cynthia: Yeah, because I do see the risk of people using cannabis as a way to just purely escape, to numb, to get away from reality. And I think that can be the stigma or the stereotype of what cannabis users can be, quote unquote stoners. So I can see really that value of cannabis nurses coming in to be like, Hey, if you are here to heal.

[00:21:28] And not just ignore or avoid, here's how you can use 

[00:21:31] Katie: this. Yes, exactly. Yeah. And for harm reduction, right? I love to work with younger people who were drawn to cannabis because we're traumatized, right? It is the medicine to reverse trauma. It's the medicine to help literally our bodies forget the trauma.

[00:21:49] aNd it's, there's a reason that kids are drawn to it. Is the answer to tell them no? Yeah. I don't know. I don't know. But is the answer to give them the education so that they can make an educated decision? Absolutely. And who are those providers giving that education? Or are they delivering judgment and shame?

[00:22:08] Yeah, 

[00:22:10] Cynthia: gosh, it's just, it makes so much sense to empower people with the information because it's, if you're going to do, if you're going to engage with this plant, then, to be informed, makes so much more sense than to just go into it blindly. 

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[00:23:12] Cynthia: You mentioned that right now.

[00:23:14] There isn't a formal like certification process It's legal, but it's still grassroots and getting figured out what are some things that people can look for in the quality of cannabis medicine or how to learn more with a cannabis nurse?

[00:23:31] Katie: Yeah, thanks so much for asking that. So one of the things that I provide is a free cannabis consult. When you're getting your information from this dispensary, they have information about their products, right? And they can help you choose products, but when it comes to, like foundational information that's really lacking in the dispensary world. And so that's really where my services come in to bridge the gap and to fill in the gaps of those knowledge. So I recommend anybody who wants to use cannabis as medicine to get a cannabis nurse consult. In that process, we're going to go through what are the terpenes?

[00:24:05] What are the cannabinoids that will meet your therapeutic goals? What are the different methods of administration? There is a lot to know in the cannabis world. And I think when you're entering into this as a new relationship or a newly defined relationship, the dispensaries and the information that's delivered can be really overwhelming as far as choosing products.

[00:24:26] My recommendation is to follow nurse Janice Champagne's. And it is making sure that your medicine comes from flower, that it's organic, that it's always lab tested, and that it's whole plant. And so as long as those kind of four criteria are met, you're getting safe medicine. I always encourage people to go through the legal avenues of regulated medicine right now, even though we are legal in the state of Minnesota. There are a lot of black market channels that are still open and we want to make sure that people are part of cannabis spirituality and part of can't conscious cannabis use is the choosing of your medicine and making sure that you have safe medicine.

[00:25:11] And so always making sure that it comes Sealed in a package with a QR code that allows you to make sure that medicine is free of any chemicals and pesticides, heavy metals, and you're getting what you're paying for. 

[00:25:23] Cynthia: Yeah. Yeah. Or, if you've got like a little telescope or microscope, then you can analyze it yourself if you're trained.

[00:25:33] Katie: You want to nerd out and get, and I really empower people to be a consumer of their cannabis medicine. Take a look at those trichomes and experience the plant through all of your senses. So definitely that's a way that we become, we come into relationship with her.

[00:25:49] Cynthia: Yeah, that was something that was really that stood out to me about your talk was the invitation to feel almost like to personify this plant medicine and calling her and connecting her to like to feminine energy and it was just such a new way of experiencing and just to, I don't know, I just loved that invitation and I can see how Even a consult with you to talk through some of the scientific information but also that spiritual connection and how you can define or redefine your relationship with cannabis.

[00:26:29] I can see how that can be really 

[00:26:30] Katie: powerful. And we dived Deep into fears too, right? The key is the key to cannabis medicine is set and setting. And so if you're going to approach her with an unresolved fear, she will show you that fear. And so talking through that on the front end so that we can cultivate that set and setting so that when you do come into new, a new relationship with her, you want to explore her as medicine that container is really intentional.

[00:26:55] And then she will really be able to show her full effects in her healing properties. That's a big part of the consult too, as we talk through some of those fears and those miss misrep anytime she was misrepresented to us to be able to clear that to get it out of the way to really truly experience her magic.

[00:27:13] Oh, I love 

[00:27:14] Cynthia: that. So a little bit of that spiritual talk as well and diving into some of the limiting beliefs that you don't want to enter into your experience with. 

[00:27:26] Katie: Exactly. 

[00:27:27] Cynthia: Yeah. Awesome. So clearly, working one on one with you sounds like such a treat. And I know we've got the link in our show notes to schedule your free consults.

[00:27:37] So if someone wants to get started or even deepen their existing practice, what are some offerings that you have? 

[00:27:46] Katie: Yeah. I invite everyone to check out my website at your higher path healing. com and you can hit request an appointment and you can see the list of the opportunities to book me there. And aside from the free cannabis consult that I offer, and the purpose of that consult is to get clear on your goals identify what cannabinoids or terpenes may be most effective for your therapeutic goals, talk through administration routes, and then I will, pitch and talk about cannabis meditation and, one on one sessions to come into that relationship.

[00:28:15] Aside from my work in cannabis on that individual one on one level, I offer one on one healing touch support and I offer that in Wyzeta and that is just a beautiful practice and they go beautifully together because sometimes the cannabis medicine will reveal some of the energy blocks that we hold in the body and then we can come back with healing touch and we can address those with healing touch and really help support that movement and that that forward momentum in the healing process.

[00:28:41] And then I really just love work in the community. Community is really important right now and healing and community and creating those spaces within community to heal is just one of my greatest passions. And I offer community healing events out in the community with cacao at this time.

[00:29:01] Cacao also works in the endocannabinoid system. It's an entheogen like cannabis is it reveals the divine within. It, it supports bliss and anandamide in the body. And that is in circle and we do beautiful meditations that really. Get us quiet and connected to that inner source of wisdom and then cannabis meditations are online at this point.

[00:29:23] When the market opens, I have big dreams of us all being in a room and consuming together and having this big, lovely, juicy, yummy container for all the lovely community healing. But right now that container is held on zoom for just for. Logistic purposes at this point in time and also the safety of your own home.

[00:29:45] So we smoke together. I do a little blessing. We smoke and then I lead about an hour long meditation to really drop into the body on that deeper level, use the cannabis, work with the breath and allow her to reveal our lessons and to shift the shit that we carry the issues are stored in our tissues.

[00:30:02] Right? And so by using conscious awareness and tension in the plant medicine, we're able to do a lot of that work on our own. 

[00:30:08] Cynthia: Beautiful. We've been able to explore the science of conscious cannabis use and also the field of cannabis nursing. It's just, there's just so much that we've been able to just dabble in this conversation. If there was one takeaway that listeners left this conversation with, what would you hope it would be?

[00:30:32] Katie: We're in a time of radical evolution as humans and we're in this really big shift of consciousness. There's a reason why we are feeling more drawn to plant medicines. They are available to us and it's important that we meet them with respect and reverence beyond their physical healing properties.

[00:30:54] They are plant medicines with a spirit. I want people to know that. They're not to be feared. They are to be revered.

[00:31:03] Cynthia: Plant medicine is here to be revered and not feared. Oh thank you so much, Katie, for just sharing your wisdom and Really spreading that message of empowerment that this is just another tool, right? This is another Just something we can use a service.

[00:31:25] It's a gift from Mother Earth I just really appreciate you sharing your experience Sharing some of the science that goes on in our system in our bodies and in our spirit So I am just grateful for all that you're doing and for being on this podcast Thank you. 

[00:31:42] Katie: Thank you for the opportunity to share.

[00:31:45] Cynthia: Thank you so much for listening to the Well Connected Twin Cities podcast. Did you learn something new? Did you feel that spark of hope and excitement for what is possible? Because so much is possible. Tell us about it in a review on Apple podcast. Not only would we absolutely love hearing from you, but these reviews help our ratings and help other curious minds like you find this resource.

[00:32:10] We are always better together. Thank you again and see you next time.